Disabled people across the country have long complained about the appalling treatment they’re subjected to when travelling by plane.

But after meeting the transport secretary today, campaigners say they’re optimistic a new law could be passed to protect their rights and dignity on flights.

The broadcaster Sophie Morgan has led the Rights on Flights campaign, and today’s meeting follows her recent documentary highlighting airlines’ shocking treatment of disabled flyers.

Jackie Long: For those people who haven’t seen what is an incredible documentary, give us a really brief sense of what life is like as a disabled flyer.

Sophie Morgan: It’s challenging. It’s really challenging. And of course, it affects us all differently depending on on disabilities. But for wheelchair users particularly, it’s challenging in the sense that we have our mobility devices removed from us, and that causes a number of problems. Whether that means that our devices get lost or broken or damaged. It also might mean that our bodies get damaged. And because of the way an aircraft is designed when we’re on board, if we are able to get on board, we’re also at risk of having to perhaps not be able to get to the bathroom. People have to starve and dehydrate. I mean, the list goes on. I can’t really do it justice in a short answer. And I would encourage people to watch the documentary because we really go into the the nuances and the challenges that we face.

Jackie Long: Looking at it from my perspective, seeing Spencer, who has to crawl on the floor, drag his body to get to the toilet. You see some of the assistants look really cack-handed. Unsafe, humiliating. What are the changes your campaign has been calling for?

Sophie Morgan: Rights On Flights was set up because my wheelchair was broken last year. And initially the ask was for the government then to make sure that when things do go wrong for disabled flyers that the airlines or the airports, the ground handlers, would be punished accordingly and that there will be consequences, because at the moment it feels like the consequences to their inaction, all their failings, is on us.

More and more disabled people are refusing to fly, turning away from flying because they’re scared, they can’t risk it. So initially the ask was just to increase those enforcement powers. But it’s expanded, and since the campaign has started, we’ve just grown and grown and grown with momentum over the year that’s been running. And now we’re asking for more than just that. We drafted what we call the assisted air travel act, which is presented again in the documentary, legislation that we hope will improve upon the current legislation that just doesn’t go far enough to protect us.

Jackie Long: The campaign has moved very, very quickly and we’ve got a new government now. You went to see the new secretary of state for transport today. What was your ask? And what did she, Louise Haigh, tell you?

Sophie Morgan: We had a really great meeting today. I’m smiling deliberately. I want there to be some good news out there about this. So the ask was about the Civil Aviation Authority. We want them to have more power so that they can respond effectively when we are let down. We also want the assisted air travel act to be adopted into law, because I don’t think people realise that the equalities act doesn’t apply in the air, which is why we’re so at risk. We asked for that.

We also have longer goals about integrating a wheelchair space on board an aeroplane. So we have lots of asks, but in the short term we want to say we want to work very closely with the government to make sure that more is done, and we have had that positive reaction that, yes we will. So we’re happy.

Jackie Long: And we know it is possible because in the documentary you go to America, you speak to the woman who would be president, Kamala Harris, who seemed to have a very good grasp of the issues. You met President Biden. Why are they so much further ahead than us?

Sophie Morgan: It’s a really great question. When I went to the US, this was last year, when the former government was in. It was so encouraging. They have had so much, I suppose, consultation with the disabled community there that they’ve actually really got the messaging right, so they know what we need, they’re listening. And when I was then campaigning last year with the Tory government, I just found that that was not happening.

That’s why I’m so hopeful now that this new government is listening, is reactive and responsive, and hears us and wants to do more. It’s the first time I’ve actually felt that there could be change in the air, and I think that’s exactly what it felt like in the US. And now it feels like that here in the UK.

Jackie Long: When you talk about change, obviously laws you want changed. Technology and infrastructure in planes themselves need to improve. But attitudes are key too, aren’t they?

Sophie Morgan: It’s all about attitude. At the end of the day, people might think this is about design, it might be about a number of other solutions. But at the heart of this is people, and I want people to understand that what we’re asking for as a disabled community. The accommodations that we need to look after us when we fly will also impact everybody. Because at some point in your life you will encounter disability. So we’re hoping this fight for rights on flights will benefit everybody.